Saucy Piaffe Inc.

I totally hear you!  I had to take my one cat into the vet's a couple weeks ago.  He had stopped eating and drinking.  The vet's original quote just for some testing to find out what was wrong was over $800.  So I told her that my hubby would divorce me if I spent that much and was there any way we could make it any cheaper?  So she let me take him home which saved me about $300.  We put him down the next day, and when all was said and done, I spent over $1,000 in two days on that cat!  Of course, the vet went on and on about "that's simply what it costs" which I think is a bunch of hooey.  And they really prey on your emotions I think, and almost make you feel like you're not a good owner if you don't do every test known to man.  It is highway robbery, IMO.

I find the vet that I use for the horse much cheaper than the vet we use for the cats. It's odd how that works. Generally, aside form having a call fee, our vet is fantastic with pricing. I believe a float (and he is a certified equine dental practitioner) is in the ball park of $53.50. THAT is do-able. I think the thing that makes the fees a bit easier to swallow is the customer service and overall attitude of the vet. When mine comes out, I use it as an opportunity to ask lots of random questions and soak up knowledge, so I figure I am getting a lesson out of the trip, which makes it "that much" more worth having the vet out. I also think that having proper insurance on your pets can be well worth it. We don't insure the two cats (even though they are our babies - I should get on that), but the horse has full med/surgical up to a reasonable amount in case of colic, etc. Luckily, I have never had to leverage the insurance (knock on wood), but it takes a load off when those small accidents happen and my mind runs awry with the "what if it had been worse" scenario.

The worst fees are the emerg vets for small animals. To walk in the door is $300 WITHOUT any diagnostics, but, you are desperate, so you are SOL. Who's gonna say, "No, my pet is in an EMERGENCY situation snd I can't pay". Most would just put it on credit and move forward with the visit. I just think that is a bit much. Then again, it is a service available at all hours and days. Always two sides to a coin. Sigh.

G.

Maybe itsirk can chime in here. See what she thinks from her perspective.  I agree with you tho PP

We are really fortunate and live in Mennonite country so utilize the services of a rural large animal practice.  We find them really reasonably priced and they will give the dogs their shots when out giving the horses their shots so only one call out fee for everything, plus cost of shots.  When Thunder had the infection we were able to pick up a big bottle of antibiotics that only cost a bit over $20.  The vet made 2 extra calls to the barn post gelding to check on Thunder (at my request) and didn't charge us.

This is the kicker though and confirmed me as a client of theirs for EVER...Thunder's surgery was badly timed in the month and we would have had to borrow money from a couple of different sources to cover the cost at Milton.  When we called up to see how much we needed to gather together the good folks at Milton said that it was already paid.  Our vet knew $$ was tight and put the entire cost on his personal credit card...yes, I did say his PERSONAL credit card!!!  He said that he has been in a similar situation himself at one time and was helped out by someone so passed that karma along and said we could pay him back as we could afford it.  We did pay it all off so that he was not carrying our debt but the fact that he did that for us and gave us a couple of weeks of breathing space is a classic example of a vet putting patients before payment!!!  We love our vet

Last edited by TeeCeeBoo (2010-07-08 15:31:49)

Tee Cee Boo -- have you any way of cloning that vet? That is what it is all about -- kindness -- and that is supposedly why they got into the profession, because they loved animals, and I'm now seeing vets who love money more. It's just plain wrong.

Why can there not be a spay/neuter clinic every few months the way they have rabies clinics? My dog came from a puppy mill in the U.S.. and the rescue took her to a vet in Ohio before she was brought up here. They did spay, teeth and shots. I can't remember the total (they give you all relevant documents when you adopt the dog) but the spay was $40.00. I showed it to my vet. After he picked himself off the floor he said, " My God, I don't think that would cover our costs." I don't think!!! What would the rest of the $350 go for?

There's something wrong when something as necessary and as routine as spay/neuters, which take minutes to do, expecially neuters, cost so much.

Maybe we should send this thread to OVC?

I really wish we could hear from Itsirk.

Last edited by pinto pony (2010-07-08 17:16:58)

I am not really sure what to reply to be honest - there are a lot of good points being made.

Pennylane - what you are suggesting about newby vets doing spays/neuters/routine stuff for cheap is actually coming to fruition next year.  THey have just opened a new "primary health care centre"
http://www.ovc.uoguelph.ca/phc/hospital … ackground/

My class will be the first graduating class to have the PHC integrated into our curriculum, and I think it's great - it will give us far more hours of practical experience than what is in the current curriculum as well as provide lower cost vet services for people.

As far as do some vet price gauge - I am sure that there are some that do.  But, for the majority - they are going by the CVO price guide - there is a "list" that the CVO sets for suggested prices for services (which MOST vets charge LESS than).  It also depends on the area that you are in - Gotcha mentioned $300 just to walk into emerg in her area - out by me, at the Cambridge emerg, it's half of that to be seen - my dog was in overnight as a pup for diarrhea/vomiting, and my bill for exam fee, emerg fee and overnight stay and SQ fluids was $180, which to me was pretty reasonable (and this is only 2 years ago).

As for the 295 just to euthanize the cat - that is disgusting.  Where I am working to euthanize a cat, with cremation, is $180, so just over half what you paid just for euth.  And the vets I work with are super compassionate for the euthanasias, if owner is present the animal is catheterized, owner can stay as long as they like, etc.

In terms of price differences between large and small animal vets, I think some of that has to do with overhead costs.  Large animal vets (generally) do not have a hospital/office location - they work out of their vans/trucks, they don't need to have as much equipment and what they do have is cheaper than small animal vet stuff (portable X-ray machine vs. stationary - HUGE price difference, but portable is not suitable for cats/dogs - you NEED stationary).  The vet I used to work for in Mtl told me his portable x-ray (USED) cost him $15K, and this is about 10 years ago.  The x-ray developer (USED) that we use at the clinic I work in costs over $1000 - I can only imagine what the x-ray machine itself costs - so, you are not just paying for the price of the film and the expertise of taking the x-ray, you're also, in the long run, paying off the machine.  And for blood work - it is around $100 for preanesthetic bloodwork where I work - again, the slides for the blood machine at cost are more than 50% of that fee, and then you need the blood taken, and again, you need to pay for the equipment the bloodwork is being run on - blood machines are not cheap - again we are talking each machine (you need three machines for chemistries, electrolytes and CBC) are over $10K - yes, the cost is amortized over years, but at the end of the day, the cost of every blood test helps cover that cost.  The pay back to you as a client - you get the results a lot faster.  When Robin had his blood drawn for his illness last year, it took over 24 hrs for my vet to get results because he doesn't have blood machines, so had to send it out to a lab.  So, while it was cheaper to get Robin's blood done than it would have for my dog - I get (routine) blood work on my dog back in 20 minutes because the small animal vet has the equipment for that.  I think that is where the big cost differences are coming in - small animal practices generally have to have a receptionist, at least one tech, a hospital that they either rent or have a mortgage on, and the equipment is much pricier.  Large animal vets don't have nearly as much overhead - my equine vet does not have a receptionist or a tech - his voice mail is reception and the horse owner the tech, he works out of his truck, and doesn't have as much equipment - so, his overhead is less.

I think it is hard because we are all so attached to our pets.  I think it comes down to finding a vet that you like and that you trust.  Where I work, for non-elective procedures (ie. a pyometra spay or a foreign body surgery), while the vet prefers they pay when they pick up their pet, as long as they pay part of the bill upfront, he will arrange a payment plan, and this is why he has tons of loyal clients.  For elective procedures though, clients do have to pay the full amount when the pet gets the surgery done as, well, it's an elective procedure.

I don't really know though!  I have always found my horse vet way cheaper than the small animal vet as well and I adore him, as well as my small animal vets (who I also find pretty reasonable). 

I hope that sheds some light on the situation!  As for me, I plan on working as an associate for at least the first couple of years post grad until I have more experience and am more confident and competent - for that time, I won't have any choice on what prices clients pay as it will be set by the practice owner.  I do eventually want to own my own practice, and until I do and see the business side and cost of everything, I find it difficult to give a fully informed answer!  I hope this has helped a bit!

I adore my horse vet, but the small animal vet, not so much. I am in flux right now because the clinic I used to take our cats to has changed ownership. It was specifically a cat hospital, now it is a general hospital. I need one for CATS. Itsirk, who is your small animal vet?

Hey Gotcha - there is a cat only clinic in Guelph, though that is a bit of a drive for you.
I was taking my pets to Cornell Animal Hospital in Guelph and they are fantastic there.  Now I would take them to the clinic I work at because they are fantastic there also, plus I get everything at cost, so it's a huge savings!  The place I work at is in Cambridge, so even further a drive than to Guelph.
Umm, my parents were using Mountainview animal hospital in Georgetown (so a lot closer for you!), and Dr. Ewing is awesome.  When our dog, Bailey, had cancer, she went to the human hospital to pick up his chemo drugs and only charged us a very small mark-up on them, and because he was in so often for his chemo, they never charged us the day board rate to keep him there for his treatments during the day.  When it came time to euthanize him, she cried and said goodbye to him like he was her own dog - they all loved him there as they knew him so well.  Most vets will refer you to OVC for chemo as it poses it's risks to the humans giving the drugs, but she was willing to do it for us.  She even offered a house call for his euthanasia, and that is not something they regularly do.  She was extremely compassionate with our pets - I would recommend her without hesitation, but she does do cats and dogs.

I've also taken my dogs to OVC as students get free checkups (like for the annual physical).  But, even with our discount (10%), it's cheaper to take them to a regular vet for most things, though the vets at OVC are all amazing.

nota Dq
Wow, what a great vet. That is how I remember MOST of them being when I was growing up. As a matter of fact that is how most Dr.'s were too. those are the ones that have to be treasured.
Itsirk- thankyou for all the info and I am excited about the sheap spay neauter clinic that is opening. Hopefully that will 'snowball' and they will pop up all over Ontario.
I understand the guide that has 'suggested' prices/charges.  That is exactly the same in retail as well, however that is NOT set in stone, however I feel that a lot of vets (and retailers too) are all too happy to follow it and rake in the $

Every supplier that I buy from also has the 'suggested retail 'prices in thier catalogues and pricelists. Those SRP are at LEAST a 100% mark up. That is not a big issue if the Retail price is $20.00 +/-, but when you are talking about items/service over $100.00 and more, that means the supplier is making at least $50.00 on that item.
Think about how far $100.00 goes in a tack shop; not to far, right ? Well when you pay $100.00, you are actually getting $50.00 worth of product at most, often only $30.00 worht of product !!!
Yes by all means make a decent living, but gouging is not necessary.
I am satisfied with making a $10.00 -$15.00 profit on a great quality embroidered hoody by selling it for $25.00 - 30.00. The same one that you can buy else where for upwards of $60.00 . Mind you I put it in a nice paper/kraft bag with the twisted/rope handles, compared to the fancy shiney printed bag the other stores supply. My way of thinking is that you are hopefully not planning on wearing the bag, so why charge you extra for that momentay luxury that will end up in the landfill.!
I have also been around some amazing vets that will not charge for an emergency call when they have to put the animal down; they only charge for the 'deed', they give you breaks when the bill is going to be big at best or the end result will not be nice.

Do vet's really love pets ?  I think they like the money .  Everyone I know is aware a neuter is simple on a cat , females are more complicated . My friend has a female cat and they want to charge her for a pre surgery blood test . This is a barn cat . She does not have any expendible cash so the cat has kittens. They told her without it the cat could die on the operating table . This is just an upsell like any other retail operation . The cost of the vaccines are very small compared to what we are charged . Ok so they spend money at University  but why do we have to pay after 20 years in practice for the Hummers and send there children to University ?  The farm call fee's are grossly over as well .  Why can't some vets donate a day for low cost spay and neuter once a month ?  A euthanasia day for horses ? I know it sounds morbid but it is needed at low cost . There are vet's out there that really care like Mark Cole at Abbortsford in Aurora and horse vets that do it for the love of horses and not money. I know them and love them !  When the subject comes up I rant .

Last edited by summer willows (2010-07-09 21:36:32)

pet insurance you may laugh but it saves money big time i have a jack russel who i adopted came with insurance 65.00 month he was 5 yrs old i consider cancelling it he is now 8 went for medical found out he had diabetis bill just for checking him,blood test treatment was 1500.00  i contacted insurance he was covered for 3000.00 life time for that catigory my final bill was 300.00 and they paid the rest i  pay for needle,insulin,and blood  once  month and they reemberce me 80% of the bill my portion is 85.00 month i can now say its worth itThe more animals you have insured small animals the cheaper the rates are.

Last edited by 4551 (2010-07-12 12:06:01)

Uh, $65 a month? That's $780 a year! That's $2,340 for the 3 years you had him before he needed it. And if you'd owned him for all 8 of those years, that would have been $6,440.

And you're still paying the $65 on top of the $85 every month, right?

That's an awful lot of money to me, 4551. I'd have trouble justifying it. Especially because, like many people on here, I have multiple animals. This month has been particularly hard because I've had two cats and a dog at the vet and I've had to call the vet out for the horse. It's $1,550 and counting. (Why am I here and not in  my office working to pay off the vets?) But I'd still question the value of pet insurance to me. Even if I could afford it, which I doubt.

But that brings me to another consumer whine . . .  Car Insurance!

Why is my house insurance only $100-odd more than my insurance on a 10-year-old Toyota Echo? That seems ridiculous to me. Anybody on here in insurance who can explain this to me?

You're right, I know you're right, but I have multiple animals and circumstances have really cut down on my income the last couple of years. I just couldn't come up with the premiums for them all, and how do you choose?

It was $800 for the dog's dental work, and I'll bet the cat will be about the same, and he's old, but what can you do? I am lucky in that my vet lets me carry a tab!

The insurance even pays for the special food, hmmm? Well, well . . .